{"id":42894,"date":"2014-09-06T15:30:14","date_gmt":"2014-09-06T20:30:14","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/?p=42894"},"modified":"2025-11-16T20:01:22","modified_gmt":"2025-11-17T02:01:22","slug":"art-of-manliness-podcast-80-starting-huckberry-with-andy-forch-richard-greiner","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/beta.artofmanliness.com\/money-wealth\/career\/art-of-manliness-podcast-80-starting-huckberry-with-andy-forch-richard-greiner\/","title":{"rendered":"Art of Manliness Podcast #80: Starting Huckberry With Andy Forch &#038; Richard Greiner"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><iframe loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/player.simplecast.com\/2082e5ef-ebf5-4eff-b902-ca3268f3dd98?dark=true\" width=\"100%\" height=\"200px\" frameborder=\"no\" scrolling=\"no\" seamless=\"\"><span data-mce-type=\"bookmark\" style=\"display: inline-block; width: 0px; overflow: hidden; line-height: 0;\" class=\"mce_SELRES_start\">\ufeff<\/span><\/iframe><\/p>\n<p style=\"color: #111111;\">Today I talk with Andy Forch and Richard Greiner, the co-founders of the men&#8217;s online store <a href=\"https:\/\/huckberry.com\/?utm_source=artofmanliness&amp;utm_medium=affiliate\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Huckberry<\/a>. If you&#8217;re a business owner or have thought about starting your own business, this podcast is for you. I ask Andy and Rich to share how they bootstrapped a business they started in their apartment and turned it into one of the largest men&#8217;s e-commerce stores on the web. As a business that&#8217;s in the business of curating men&#8217;s lifestyle products, Andy and Rich have seen firsthand what separates a successful men&#8217;s product from an unsuccessful one, and what you can do to stand out from the increasingly crowded market of &nbsp;&#8220;artisanal&#8221; men&#8217;s products.<\/p>\n<h3 style=\"color: #111111;\">Show Highlights<\/h3>\n<ul>\n<li>Where the idea for Huckberry came from<\/li>\n<li>How long it took Andy and Richard to turn their idea into an actual business<\/li>\n<li>How do you start an e-commerce biz when you don&#8217;t know anything about retail<\/li>\n<li>What it&#8217;s like to go from working from your apartment to having an office and a warehouse and over a dozen employees in four years<\/li>\n<li>How they scored their first big brand to be in their store<\/li>\n<li>Why Andy and Richard chose not to get venture capital and to just bootstrap their biz (and why they continue to refuse offers from investors today)<\/li>\n<li>Why you probably shouldn&#8217;t try to start that artisanal men&#8217;s leather goods business<\/li>\n<li>And much more!<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<div style=\"color: #111111;\">\n<h3>Listen to the Podcast! (And don\u2019t forget to leave us a review!)<\/h3>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/the-art-of-manliness\/id332516054?mt=2\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter wp-image-49206 size-full\" src=\"https:\/\/content.artofmanliness.com\/uploads\/2015\/07\/available-on-itunes.png\" alt=\"Available on itunes.\" width=\"250\" height=\"92\" data-pin-nopin=\"true\"\/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter wp-image-49207 size-full\" src=\"https:\/\/content.artofmanliness.com\/uploads\/2015\/07\/available-on-stitcher.png\" alt=\"Available on Stitcher.\" width=\"250\" height=\"92\" data-pin-nopin=\"true\"\/><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/soundcloud.com\/artofmanliness\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter wp-image-49208 size-full\" src=\"https:\/\/content.artofmanliness.com\/uploads\/2015\/07\/soundcloud-logo.png\" alt=\"Soundcloud logo.\" width=\"250\" height=\"127\"\/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/pcasts.in:443\/NwCI\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter wp-image-49655\" src=\"https:\/\/content.artofmanliness.com\/uploads\/\/2015\/08\/pocketcasts.png\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 225px) 100vw, 225px\" srcset=\"\" alt=\"Pocketcasts.\" width=\"225\" height=\"225\"\/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/play.google.com\/music\/managemusic?t=The_Art_of_Manliness\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter wp-image-56926 size-full\" src=\"https:\/\/content.artofmanliness.com\/uploads\/2016\/05\/google-play-podcast-e1464287132541.png\" alt=\"Google play podcast.\" width=\"250\" height=\"190\"\/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/2vJHmWhhcMQRXtTruuFWTJ\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter wp-image-81682\" src=\"https:\/\/content.artofmanliness.com\/uploads\/2018\/01\/open-graph-default.png\" alt=\"Spotify Logo.\" width=\"248\" height=\"130\" srcset=\"https:\/\/content.artofmanliness.com\/uploads\/2018\/01\/open-graph-default.png 400w, https:\/\/content.artofmanliness.com\/uploads\/2018\/01\/open-graph-default-320x168.png 320w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 248px) 100vw, 248px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/art19.com\/shows\/the-art-of-manliness\/episodes\/db7c2126-cce5-4ca7-a5e8-de99285a3688\">Listen to the episode on a separate page.<\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/rss.art19.com\/episodes\/db7c2126-cce5-4ca7-a5e8-de99285a3688.mp3\">Download this episode.<\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/www.omnycontent.com\/d\/playlist\/aaea4e69-af51-495e-afc9-a9760146922b\/6081eee7-c459-4e12-a1ab-aadc000fc4a7\/413a6904-4d72-4be8-9421-aadc000fc4ba\/podcast.rss\">Subscribe to the podcast in the media player of your choice.<\/a><\/p>\n<\/div>\n<div style=\"color: #111111;\">\n<h3>Read the Transcript<\/h3>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Brett McKay here and welcome to another edition of the Art of Manliness Podcast. So if you\u2019ve been visiting the site for the past few years, you\u2019re probably familiar with the company called Huckberry. It\u2019s an online e-commerce store company that sells products and gears directed towards men who happened to like doing sort of outdoor adventure stuff. We do a weekly give away with them. We do a curated shop with them, that\u2019s on holidays and at Father\u2019s Day. We\u2019re an affiliate of them. We\u2019re business partners and on a certain time you can make a purchase through our Huckberry link we will make small percentage from that and that helps support the website and everything that goes along with it.<\/p>\n<p>Anyways, I wanted to bring on the two Co-Founders of Huckberry to share their story of how they started Huckberry, because it\u2019s a really cool story of a successful bootstrapped startup. Andy Forch, Richard Greiner, they started Huckberry when they were relatively young, mid-20s, out of their apartment and now it\u2019s grown into this large business in about four or five years where they have an office and a warehouse and they\u2019re employing over a dozen different people to do their job to fulfill their sales. So I wanted to get them on to share their story of how they started their successful business, because I know a lot of you listening to the podcast are wanting to do that, become entrepreneur, start your own business. So I wanted to have Andy and Richard share their story and their insights and their mistakes they made along in the way so you can get something from it.<\/p>\n<p>Also I wanted to get their insights about something. I get stuffs sent to me all the time from brands and people who\u2019re wanting to start some sort of male lifestyle product, brand or whatever and Huckberry gets that 100 times more. And I wanted to get Richard and Andy\u2019s insight on what separates the winners and losers from companies or brands wanting to sell a product that\u2019s directed towards men. So if you\u2019ve had sort of an idea kicking around and starting a men\u2019s lifestyle product, brand or whatever, you want to listen to this because you will get some really good insights I think from some people who know firsthand on what makes a successful brand or product.<\/p>\n<p>Anyways, it\u2019s really fascinating, it\u2019s all that entrepreneurship, all about being \u2013 starting a successful business. I think that that\u2019s something you want to do. You\u2019re going to get a lot out of this podcast, so let\u2019s do this.<\/p>\n<p>All right, Richard and Andy welcome to the show.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Thanks Brett, pleasure to be with you Brett.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Likewise, thanks Brett.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: All right, just so we know who I\u2019m talking to. Can you be like hey this is Andy and \u2013 or hey this is Richard.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: So this is Andy and Richard has the radio voice. So there is really no mistaking the two of us.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah. Hey Brett, Richard here and I would say the TV anchor face, so\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: All right. So you guys are the Founders of Huckberry and if you have been reading the site for a few years, you guys know who Huckberry is\u2026 we do a give away with them every week. We\u2019ve been a partner with them for a while back. So I\u2019m really excited to have you guys on the show to talk about how Huckberry started, talking about being entrepreneurs, talk about the war stories of starting your own business in the men\u2019s lifestyle genre. And maybe get some cool insights about this really cool company that you guys started.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah, absolutely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: It\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: All right. So let\u2019s see a little background on you, because you guys are young guys relatively speaking. What did you guys do before Huckberry? How old are you? Why did you start Huckberry?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yep Brett, Richard here. So I was just telling somebody that started about this earlier today and Andy and I followed very identical life paths. We both went to school on the East Coast, I went to Villanova, Andy went to UVA. We both graduated in 2007 and we\u2019re sort of funneled to New York City as we\u2019re both working in finance at that time which at that point in time was sort of still the hot day in the work.<\/p>\n<p>And I actually got transferred out to San Francisco in I think March of 2008 and Andy got transferred out here in August of 2008. And didn\u2019t know each other, same exact path and met at a mutual friend\u2019s party out here and so we became good friends and we are active and outdoorsy. And we\u2019re on a ski trip one time and you started throwing around ideas with your buddies and you\u2019ve done it 100 times and you never think one of these will take hold and one of those ideas sort of took hold and I can let Andy kind of dive in a little bit more of the specifics here. But it was just one of those things where you\u2019re messing around, you have some drinks one night and the next thing you know, you\u2019re quitting your jobs to sort of dive in head first.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah. And just to peg you back on that Brett, its Andy speaking. One of the funny things that Richard and I figured after the fact is when I moved to San Francisco we lived on the same block. And before we met a party that one of our buddies hosted, I think it was around like Great White Sharks. He is like a Great White Shark photographer hosted a party, that\u2019s when Rich and I met. We found out that we actually lived on the same block in New York and didn\u2019t meet each other. So I mean we literally \u2013 we had pretty identical paths, just all the way through starting Huckberry and then now I like to joke I\u2019m basically I have two marriages, I\u2019m married to my wife and married to Richard, so life is converged even more.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Do you guys argue like you\u2019re married?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: That\u2019s awesome.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: And honestly like I think just like you learn in marriage like learning how to resolve problems and how do you speak to each other and how do you reinforce each other like it\u2019s just as important in a business partnership as it is in a marriage.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: So yeah, okay. You guys are in finance. How old where you at the time right before you guys started doing the Huckberry thing?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: I think we\u2019re 25, 26.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: So we were pretty young. We had both been an analyst at investment banks. And after you sort of do your three days which feel like dog years, you have to figure out you want to sort of stay in the game and grind it out and build a career or not. And San Francisco is just so different from New York. I was staying in corporate housing \u2013 in sort of the same corporate housing where a lot of the y-combinator guys where like the first class or two. So I think founder of dropbox was in there, a bunch of other guys and the whole \u2013 the spirit of San Francisco was all around entrepreneurship and being sort of the finance guy or I will take a shot at you Brett, the lawyer day. You\u2019re sort of the bud of many different \u2013 of many jokes and everyone celebrates entrepreneurship. So for us we kind of had to make a decision as far as kind of what path to go down and it just made it that much easier being out here, because everyone \u2013 all our friends were kind of supporting it. I think if we\u2019re still in New York and had come up with an idea to start a business in an industry we had absolutely no experience in, we probably would have been laughed out of the room. But I think here, San Francisco, they sort of support that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. All right, so you guys sort of talking you guys met at a party sort of talk, then you became friends, just kind of share the common interest and outdoor stuff. So how did \u2013 I mean where did the idea of Huckberry come from? How did you guys generate this idea of we\u2019re going to create this \u2013 well before we get there, for those who aren\u2019t familiar with Huckberry, can you kind of just give the elevator pitch of what Huckberry is? Because sometimes it\u2019s like it\u2019s hard to explain like when people ask me like what\u2019s Huckberry, I\u2019m like it\u2019s kind of explain to folks if unless they see it.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah. It is hard to explain. I think at our core we\u2019re an online shop and journal for guys. The way I like to sort of explain it is we\u2019re out there trying to find the next Patagonia before its Patagonia. These really cool merchant brands are doing great things; they\u2019re doing it the right way. They\u2019re creating great products as much as possible we love brands where they make the product here in the U.S. So that\u2019s sort of the \u2013 kind of what boils down to I think the thing that Rich and I use to kind of steer the ship here is sort of our unofficial mission statement at which we probably put our heads together and make it official at some point and put a little more thought into it. But it\u2019s basically to inspire more active adventurous and stylish lives and to do that through content and commerce.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: So you guys are sort of like curators in a lot in a sense?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah, absolutely. And I think for us like the real value that we provide with these brands are just being storytellers. They have such great stories to tell that makes our life really easy and just giving them sort of more reach across the country. And that\u2019s sort of the genesis of Huckberry in many ways was that we saw all these really cool brands that had like cult followings in like San Francisco or New York or in the Midwest. And they\u2019re just making great product and they just really didn\u2019t have sort of distribution. And so we kind of saw the opportunity to get in there and highlight a lot of these brands and sure East Coast runs what everyone is doing on the West Coast and Rich is from the Midwest and so he knew about a bunch of brands, it was kind of plugged in there. So it really is at our core word discovery.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Very cool. So you guys got this idea, you saw a need for curation or helping people get the word out about these really cool brands. How long did it take to take that idea and turn it into an actual business?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: It\u2019s a good question. Ultimately from sort of the day we quit our jobs and we\u2019re able to fully commit to the idea until Huckberry was live, it was five or six months all in. I think we had figured out that general sort of business plan and what we are going to take in a couple of months and then from there it was sort of technical, building the website, figuring out all the logistics behind running an e-commerce business and that sort of thing that was part of the reason it took six months instead of two or three. And that was called a little over four years ago. So it\u2019s interesting the world\u2019s become much, much sort of simpler to get to start a brand or an e-commerce site. So I think realistically you can probably be three or four months, it took us six and that\u2019s partially because of when we started and then also having pretty much zero technical knowledge and just figuring out things as we go along. So six months all in for us, we can probably do it less.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: All right. So you guys actually quit your jobs before you started getting into this heavy. Is that right?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah. You got to go all in. I think some people can kind of do it on the side, but you get to that point where you kind of have to burn the boats on the beach so to speak and just sort of dive balling it especially for something as involved as an e-commerce site. And particularly our model which our model isn\u2019t make a shirt and sell it and just put another order for that shirt and sell the next Batch like the Huckberry site refreshes multiple times during the week and it\u2019s just so involved that there is just no way we could have moonlighted the product.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. I mean so okay, did you guys any experience in retail before this or did you thought like sort of learn on the fly?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: We learned 100% on the fly.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Wow!<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: So I think this \u2013 sort of taking a quick step back, one of the sort of genesis is on the customer or user side is that we didn\u2019t think that any e-commerce or shopping sites really spoke to us. Very often the shopping sites are going to be for really high ends, $5,000 suit type people or sort of the really high end outdoor performance. I\u2019m climbing Mt. Everest and sort of super technical. And Andy and I were sort of the everyday guys, the guys in the middle that just weren\u2019t being properly served and weren\u2019t being sort of spoken to from the commerce side. So that was really sort of a big part of it for us.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: And Brett to kind of peg you back on that, it\u2019s funny in that. I think there are brands up there like Poler which I know you\u2019re familiar with who basically sort of built their model around that like most people like up until like kind of the Poler movement I would sort of call it and there are bunch of other brands like Poler now. But it was all like Everest this, Everest that and like most guys are like I actually just want to like go into the backwoods and like go camping with my family this weekend or with my buddies. And so we definitely saw kind of the convergence of what we call like urban and outdoor that there are these brands out there that were really teller to guys who lived in the city or the suburbs but loved the outdoors.<\/p>\n<p>And a funny story that we always like tell is Rich went to \u2013 I think was it SIA or Outdoor Retailer, one of these big outdoor tradeshows. Trying to go \u2013 signup all these brands and kind of sell them on Huckberry and he had no site. We didn\u2019t have a site that was live. The only thing that we had was I picked a Photoshop for dummies book and I made some pretty slick business cards. So he is walking around to all these like big brands like Patagonia and the North Face, trying to get them signed up and just kind of getting laughed away.<\/p>\n<p>And the one sort of relationship should give you more credit, I\u2019m sure you developed more relationships than just one. But the one that was sort of meaningful was Benji, the Founder of Poler who at that point didn\u2019t have any products on his site; he just had this heat bag. I think Richard exchanged a heat bag for one of his slick business cards and just kind of had like a similar viewpoint and it\u2019s become one of our best relationships.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: That\u2019s awesome. So okay, so it sounds like you learned Photoshop on your own, because you guys do all the graphic stuff for Huckberry things and\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah. So the genesis of it was Rich and I had this idea, we love the gear, saw the opportunity, I had no experience in retail. Obviously we\u2019re not technical founders either. And so we partnered with Richard\u2019s\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah, childhood friends, little brother, he was getting his computer science degree at Berkley.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: At Berkley, yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: So he moonlit with us and helped us sort of build out Huckberry 1.0, get the site off the ground and the perspective that we took was let\u2019s get something nicely put together. But it\u2019s more important to get the site launch, get products out there and start getting feedback from people, from people and from brands and suppliers which I think is one really big key for start up as an entrepreneur and which is this model that we live by and it\u2019s called you always threw out your first pancake, so get cooking. And so it was really about getting a product out there, getting Huckberry started and then the feedback you get from your customers is infinitely more valuable than showing a website to your friends and advisors and getting feedback from them. So it was really about let\u2019s get a pretty good product out there and get it launched and then kind of refine from there.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: And Brett, you know this like \u2013 so Rich and I kind of in are like finance group of friends. We\u2019re sort of like one of the very few entrepreneurs, we get every sort of \u2013 I have an idea, can I talk about it, email that\u2019s out there. And many of them are sort of in business school and the real world as we like to call it is just so different from business school where you\u2019re in business school, you have an idea, you basically you pitch it to the class and it\u2019s sort of a safe place, right. Like you\u2019re pitching the business and you\u2019re in an environment where the teachers are being paid to listen to and the students are being paid to listen to and the students are being paid to provide feedback.<\/p>\n<p>And then you get into the real world and it\u2019s like I remember when we were sort of pitching Huckberry to people, they just don\u2019t even respond to the email. And so that really does show the importance of just like putting a product out there and letting people vote with their wallets and at some point you kind of have to stand on your own two feet.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: That\u2019s awesome. I love the pancake; you throw out your first pancake, that\u2019s true. I threw out my first pancake.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: And you guys, there is something I think a lot of people know as well is that you guys handle most of the shipping as well, right?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yep.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah, we do which was \u2013 it first started off as Andy and I shipping out of our apartments which was \u2013 girlfriends and wives weren\u2019t too happy about that one. But we basically had a schedule where that we knew the mail pickup was 5 O\u2019clock in the afternoon and at 3 O\u2019clock pencils down everybody and we started packing boxes and run them over to the post office before it closed for the nightly shipment. And it went from shipping five packages a day to 10 packages a day and now we\u2019re shipping sometimes 1000s of packages a day.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: That\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: And you guys have \u2013 I don\u2019t know, you guys have upgraded since I last saw you.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: But the last time when I was in San Francisco a few years ago and you\u2019re like a garage, it was insane. It was just like packages everywhere and you\u2019re like a team who handles. And that\u2019s like someone who\u2019s got \u2013 I just got started in e-commerce, I know like the shipping and fulfillment, that\u2019s like \u2013 that\u2019s really complex and complicated. A lot of people when they get in they want to start an online business where they\u2019re selling a product. They think well that\u2019s going to be easy, but it\u2019s a lot more \u2013 it\u2019s tricky, it\u2019s hard.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah, it\u2019s very tricky. And that\u2019s one of the things that\u2019s \u2013 one of the biggest challenges to growing a larger e-commerce business is \u2013 are figuring those sort of operational and fulfillment \u2013 figuring out those problems. And you don\u2019t think about it, but once you go from shipping 10 packages a day to 100 packages a day, your customer service in balance will max and you have to start figuring that out. And then yeah, it really becomes quite challenging to figure out the logistics and operational side. But it\u2019s something where if orders start coming in, you\u2019re going to be \u2013 you\u2019re going to figure it out. So it\u2019s again learning sort of \u2013 learning by fire and throwing out that pancake as you grow.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: All right. So you guys \u2013 you said you started four years ago, so it was like 2010 you guys officially went to business.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: It was May 2011.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: May 2011?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah. We quit our jobs in I think September or October of \u201810 and then\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Launched the site in April 2011.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah, April 7<sup>th<\/sup>.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: All right. So it was just you two at the beginning shipping stuff out your apartments. How big is your team now?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: So we\u2019ve got \u2013 I will call it about 16 of us in the office, maybe 17 depending on how you count part-time people and then another dozen or so that are working in our warehouse, so close to 30 people between sort of full-time and part-time and then warehouse staff.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: That\u2019s crazy. Well that\u2019s amazing, that\u2019s phenomenal that you guys are got so big so fast. All right, I know early on guys that you didn\u2019t guys take venture capital to start your business. And I know you guys are in San Francisco, you\u2019re talking about the whole idea of entrepreneurship is really big in that area and a big part of that culture is like everyone wants venture capital, everybody wants their money for their start up. Why didn\u2019t you guys make that decision not to take venture capital?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: I think Brett there are sort of a few things. When we were sort of standing on the ledge of whether to jump into this or not, I think one of the sites and blogs we read a lot and that we really subscribed to was 37signals, I guess their blog is called Signal vs. Noise. And the Founder Jason Fried, I sense written a few books, Rework, I think there is like one or two others. And he is just a huge fan of bootstrapping your business and I think it was sort of in our DNA and that like we graduated from school, went into a white-collar job. But I think we have a pretty like blue-collar mentality when it comes down to it and that we both love getting our hands dirty and kind of rolling up our sleeves and picking up Photoshop for dummies. That\u2019s how we designed the site and just doing things really, really cheaply.<\/p>\n<p>So I think that was sort of \u2013 and honestly that we are pretty lucky to choose a business model where we could sort of afford to do that and that like if you\u2019re starting a button-down or a button-down t-shirt company and your sort of capital requirements for that. You have to pay money six months before you can actually \u2013 to buy the fabric and get it, cut in some and then you launch it to the public and your capital cycle is getting paid six months after you cut that first cheque. We were lucky in that. Starting in the beginning it was primarily sort of a presale model with our customers. So it\u2019s a combination of wanting to kind of control our own destiny which is what bootstrapping allows you to do. Choosing a business that sort of allowed us to bootstrap and that was bootstrap friendly.<\/p>\n<p>I think one of the things we say to every entrepreneur is like if you can \u2013 if you can afford to bootstrap your business, absolutely do it. We\u2019re huge fans of it, but we also recognize that it\u2019s one it\u2019s not for every model, it\u2019s not for every person and there are absolutely some tradeoffs in that. We definitely grow a lot slower than we could and part of that is just risk talent, but also if we raise money it would be kind of pedal to the metal. But I don\u2019t know, it\u2019s like I think in many ways is particularly on. You\u2019re just trying to like find your nation and find your voice and find yourself and find the business. And I just think it was nice not raising venture capital and sort of being forced to just grow like crazy when maybe you\u2019re not even growing the right business.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Very interesting. And do you guys still get approached \u2013 I\u2019m sure you guys get approached by people who want to stake in the business?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah, definitely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah, I mean it\u2019s so cool. I mean it\u2019s a really cool model that you guys have gone. But it\u2019s great you\u2019ve maintained that control and have grown at your own pace. So you started in 2011 and at this time there were sort of sites like yours there were popping up like these sort of curated membership deal sites where you signup and every week there is like a new line up and you get some discounts like there is Gilt and I forgot some of the other ones, like this all seem to popup at the same time. And \u2013 so how did you guys set yourself apart from the pack? And I think you\u2019ve kind of referenced it a little bit in your conversation, but how did \u2013 what did you guys do to make yourself different from all those other curated store sites?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah. So I think there is a couple of things Brett. First half is from day-one of starting Huckberry we always wanted to sort of tell the story of our brand partners first. So we weren\u2019t all about putting product in your face and just being pushy and product focus. We were about let\u2019s go and find real cool people that are doing really cool things and making awesome products and leading with telling that story.<\/p>\n<p>So I think our focus has always been story first and let\u2019s sort of get behind why we love this brand or this product. And so that has really developed the story first and content approach to commerce. That has really developed overtime into a full-blown journal blog that gets great traffic and it\u2019s sort of something that really separates us from most other commerce sites out there. So there is \u2013 that\u2019s definitely a big part of it.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: And I think a few other ways we sort of differentiate ourselves early on, I think as time has gone on like we\u2019ve definitely found our voice even more. I think we\u2019ve got like more dialed in on like what exactly our edit is, what\u2019s like a Huckberry brand, what\u2019s the Huckberry way of saying that. And again it all kind of comes back to storytelling and really just trying to be a signal in sort of a market where there is a lot of noise, so a lot of these other shopping sites whether it\u2019s members only or even just retail, a lot of these retailers they sort of lead with like the best deal. So they will call for a brand and will say hey like what can I buy for 70% of wholesale and they\u2019re like oh well, we have some stuff from 2011 I couldn\u2019t move that I could sell you for pennies on the dollar.<\/p>\n<p>And our mentality is like hey let\u2019s go and find the coolest brands and then let\u2019s bring our readers like the absolute \u2013 like best selection from the coolest brand and then we don\u2019t need to buy it 70% off wholesale, because we want \u2013 like we basically have two customers who want our brands come back to us and give us exclusive product and exclusive releases and collaborate it and then but we also want our customers to kind of get a great deal. So that\u2019s why when you\u2019re on Huckberry, it was typically 10% off, 15% off, but it\u2019s the best price on the internet and it \u2013 we would argue it\u2019s sort of the best product selection.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. I mean that\u2019s kind of what\u2019s sold me on it eventually. That\u2019s \u2013 and you kind of telling the story, it\u2019s kind of funny. So like when you guys approached me back in I guess 2011 about hey you want to be an affiliate, help \u2013 work with us, I was like \u2013 I was getting inundated with like emails from people like hey I got this membership deal site and I was just like \u2013 my default answer became no and so I told you guys no.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah. Probably doing the ax give away with you actually.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. But you guys were persistent and you finally got me on the phone and like you\u2019re like were able to tell me like this is what \u2013 your vision like what you wanted to do. That was like \u2013 it\u2019s sort of like outdoor stuff for like the guy who was in the suburbs of the cities and telling stories about how you can use this stuff to like go and live a life of adventure and like do cool stuff. And I was like okay, I will give it a try and since then it\u2019s been a fantastic partnership.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah, it certainly has Brett and I will \u2013 Andy and I remember the day very specifically when you did a nice write up about some of the different men\u2019s shopping sites out. And you sort of mentioned Huckberry\u2019s head above shoulders of the rest. That was definitely a big day for us to have your endorsement. One thing that we\u2019ve really tried to do as we\u2019ve grown and sort of figured out our path in the business life is like one thing you mentioned was being persistent, and then two finding people to partner with that are \u2013 you\u2019re going to form a deep partnership \u2013 deep relationship with. Somebody that sort of sees the world through your lands and you \u2013 it just sort of makes sense like you would be friends outside of the internet world.<\/p>\n<p>And so I think you are sort of very early on in that approach and that\u2019s something we\u2019ve just really maintained throughout our three and half, four years of being in business is trying to partner with people that just make a lot of sense and not going out there and partnering with everybody and trying to find, establish more meaningful, deeper partnerships.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. I think that\u2019s an important point to make, because there are a lot of young entrepreneurs who get this idea that it\u2019s sort of just the numbers game, right like make as many phone calls, send as many emails and even if like the people you\u2019re contacting like wouldn\u2019t be a good fit for you, right?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Right.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: And I mean it\u2019s just such a waste of time and instead yeah they were just focused and like actually find those people who would be \u2013 they would provide value to them and they would provide value to \u2013 they would value get from them, just be more effective.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah Brett, to this day I mean I know Rich and I sort of credit you with \u2013 it\u2019s sort of our big break in many ways and just sincerely thankful of sort of the friendship and partnership that we\u2019ve come up with. One thing I don\u2019t know if I ever told you, I remember I was on my honeymoon in Brazil with my wife Kate and I remember kind of \u2013 I woke up in the middle of the night and was like answering Huckberry emails and just kind of like thinking about some of our growth plans. I remember just like writing a bunch of partners I thought made sense and then at the top of the list was you and I just circled and I was like man, we just have to make this happen like it\u2019s such a great \u2013 just from like a value standpoint how we look at the world. It\u2019s just such a great partnership and that\u2019s probably why you got seven emails the next week and I would sort of caveat that by saying that I\u2019m kidding and please don\u2019t send Brett seven emails, it\u2019s not the way to do it. But that was sort of the start of it.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. It\u2019s been a fantastic partnership and I loved working with you guys. And like we just said it\u2019s like we\u2019re friends outside of the internet which is awesome.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: I was going to tell you guys speaking of like how big you\u2019ve got, I saw a Huckberry adventure cap in the wild in Tulsa, Oklahoma.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Oh mine.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. I went to go and get donuts with my kid and there is this guy sitting outside eating donuts, he is like a student here in Tulsa, he was wearing the Huckberry hat and I was like hey nice hat. And he is like \u2013 and he recognized me from the website, so yeah, I know you\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Oh wow!<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: It was cool though to see Huckberry hat in Tulsa, Oklahoma.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah. Brett, I have a similar story for you real quick. So you\u2019re obviously familiar with GORUCK, we\u2019ve done a couple of challenges. We host this sort of annual or semiannual party with them called War Stories and Beer where they come to our offices and we clear everything out and they have some of the GORUCK \u2013 what they call\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Cadres.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Cadre\u2019s and they give up \u2013 they go up there and they talk about experiences from their time at war and coming back to Huckberry or coming back to the United States and readjusting and everything. It\u2019s just a \u2013 it\u2019s a great night and you\u2019re raising money for the wounded warriors and et cetera, et cetera. And so we hosted one of those about three months ago and this guy comes up to Andy and I and he goes oh, are you Andy and Richard and we started talking to him. And it turns out he was turned on to Huckberry through you way back in the day, two or three years ago through Huckberry who learned about GORUCK and has since done five or six challenges with them. And he flew out from Washington D.C. to come out to the GORUCK war stories at the Huckberry offices.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah, that\u2019s awesome.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: So it\u2019s like a total \u2013 just one of those great evenings to hear that story.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: That\u2019s awesome. And I want to talk more about some of that stuff that you guys were doing, going beyond just retail and telling stories, because you guys are doing more than that, we\u2019ll get that in a second. But let\u2019s get to this first. So you guys are in this position now where you\u2019re tastemakers, right. Brands, you used to be like you have to like go to the retail \u2013 what are they, conventions or whatever those things are called.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. And try to like hey pitch your business to them, but now companies are coming to you, right and a few years ago it seemed like there was really a dearth of quality like products for men. But these days every time I turn around I see some new start up that\u2019s turning out leather bags or journal covers or a canvas docket or like stuff made from wood or manly soap or what \u2013 I mean you guys know, you guys have seen this stuff. Do you think the market for these kind of products, is it saturating? And if there is a guy out there like I want to start some sort of male lifestyle product, what advice would you give that guy who is thinking about starting a business in that niche?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah. So Brett I think specifically I will sort of start with leather, because it seems like we see more leather products than anything else. The thing about leather is that it\u2019s really easy to create a \u2013 let\u2019s say a wallet business, design a really nice \u2013 a good looking wallet used right leather, maybe you contract out the work, maybe you do it yourself, put on the internet, post some pretty pictures and sell a few thousand. The problem is that can almost be sort of a false indicator, because it\u2019s easy to create a leather business where you can sell a few thousand, it\u2019s really tough to build like $1 million a year leather business or maybe it\u2019s $500,000 a year. But \u2013 and that\u2019s because the market is so saturated that there is this real desire and hunger for great leather products.<\/p>\n<p>But building sort of a sustainable business outside of just kind of a pet project can be really tough and I think a lot of guys have maybe started selling stuff on Etsy and then kind of jumped in and found that it wasn\u2019t sort of \u2013 the market wasn\u2019t as robust or as supportive of their vision as they thought, so that\u2019s just sort of one thing to keep an eye on. I think at the end of the day it all comes down to like viewpoint. There is just \u2013 my first boss said having a viewpoint in \u2013 like a distinct viewpoint is worth 20 IQ points and it\u2019s something that I think we sort of engrained here at Huckberry like with the brand. When we\u2019re sort of assessing a brand, it\u2019s like it\u2019s a crowded market, why this brand above anything else. Is it great value? Is there sort of a craftsmanship story? How authentic is sort of the brand?<\/p>\n<p>And so the storytelling component of it which is the thing that we focus on and which is really what gets these brands in the door is the most important thing. So if you don\u2019t have the viewpoint and you\u2019re just doing something because you don\u2019t want to \u2013 you don\u2019t like your nine to five job and you\u2019re just looking for an out, I think that can be like a pretty scary path to go down.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Okay. I mean \u2013 but I mean what about \u2013 I mean guys you like \u2013 I mean with the leather thing, there is people who I think are really trying to sort of brand and they try to like they come up with a story, right about \u2013 they talk about sort of the catch words like American craftsmanship made in USA, like sort of those buzz words that are like artisanal. I mean there is a story there, but like how do you \u2013 I mean I guess how do you \u2013 if stories are what\u2019s really important in commerce today, how do you come up with I guess the story that sets you apart?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: It\u2019s definitely a lot trickier now than it was three or four or five years ago. Things that we look for when we\u2019re sort of evaluating in balance is going to be what did that person do before they went to leather. Like is there a story of why they got into it or were they working sort of around the peripherals of leather or any craftsmanship like why did they get involved? Was it just because they didn\u2019t like their nine to five and they want to quit or is it a sort of a family tradition that\u2019s been past down through the generations or is it \u2013 you grew up on a horse ranch and you worked with leather your whole life, right? So trying to find like what\u2019s the real story behind somebody doing something or is it just I want to start a business, this is trendy right now, I\u2019m going to get into American male leather products.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: So that\u2019s definitely like do you really have an angle or do you have something that like makes you really want to be doing it not just because it\u2019s the trendy thing. So that\u2019s definitely something like follow your passion in whatever you do and if you\u2019re not passionate about what you do, you\u2019re not going to be successful. And that\u2019s one of the core things about Huckberry like we started Huckberry for us, because we didn\u2019t think there was something out there that was speaking to us. And so make sure you\u2019re passionate about what you do, because it is a pain in the butt at times, it\u2019s wonderful at times, but it\u2019s something that you have to really love to be able to be successful at.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: All right. So I\u2019m sure \u2013 so yeah, okay, you guys see a lot of like upstart businesses, some last most of them don\u2019t. What are the successful entrepreneurs doing that the not so successful ones are doing?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: They keep going. I mean you can start with that. Just keep going and keep the feet moving. And I think it\u2019s sort of a combination of things. I think one, the successful ones are playing a long game like we\u2019re a e-commerce retailer, but I think the secret sauce of the Huckberry brand is built on personal relationships, going to these tradeshows, getting out in the community, having face-to-face, developing relationships. So even though the customer has \u2013 like sees a experience online that\u2019s feels digital, there is so much humanness behind it. And I think that\u2019s been sort of one thing that has done wonders for us and I think for a lot of these brands that like if you\u2019re a leather brand and you\u2019re super passionate about what you\u2019re doing and you\u2019re out there kind of forging industry relationships, I think that really goes a long way.<\/p>\n<p>So I think some of the unsuccessful ones sort of discount that and they sort of send those impersonal blast females, dear, dear Mr. Art of Manliness, didn\u2019t even take the time to look up your name. I started a leather company, here is the price like let\u2019s do a give away and they probably got your name wrong, right.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah, they would get my name wrong, Brent or like would call them Brad or whatever.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: And so it\u2019s really \u2013 it\u2019s the sniff test. It\u2019s like are these guys playing the long game and so Rich kind of alluded to this earlier, but it really is like are they just kind of \u2013 you get the sense that they\u2019re doing things the right way and after really in it for \u2013 they aren\u2019t trying to sell for three months, but they\u2019re in it because they think they\u2019re going to be doing this five years from now. And I think those who have that sort of long-term vision, it\u2019s sort of trickles down to the decisions they make each day and sort of how they build the brand, how they go about selling their product and so it\u2019s how we\u2019re going to\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: And Brett just to hop in here real quick, for me and I\u2019m going to share this as well, you have to be a doer. It\u2019s all about action when you\u2019re starting a company and just getting things going and trying and learning by mistakes. And you can\u2019t over think things; you can\u2019t make the best product out there. You have to really start doing. And so we look for someone that\u2019s got a lot of initiative and that\u2019s really just get \u2013 it\u2019s so hungry to get going, you have to hold them back really and that sense of doing is really, really important especially at the early stage start up.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. I think that\u2019s a great point to make, because I feel like a lot of people have this idea that I have to have the perfect business plan before I can get started. And I have to like know everything about whatever it is I\u2019m doing to \u2013 before I actually get started on something. But the thing is like the way you really learn how to run a business is just getting your hands dirty and that\u2019s\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: And yeah, it seems like my area where people want to \u2013 like always get \u2013 I\u2019m always getting asked questions like how to start a successful blog and like they want to sit down and like they have all these questions and they never get started though. And it\u2019s just like I\u2019m just telling you just got to get started, just get something out there.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Brett, my sort of favorite or I just say one of my favorite quotes in entrepreneurship was actually by Mike Tyson and he said everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face, right. And I think that\u2019s sort of \u2013 that\u2019s a great way to look at it. Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face and you just \u2013 you have to get out there and see whether you can stand up on your own two feet and take those hits.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Awesome. I love \u2013 I\u2019m glad we got some Mike Tyson was doing here.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: There is not much of it.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: All right. So I think a lot of people might look at you two and think that you guys have like the ultimate dream job. I mean I\u2019m sure they just imagine like all you\u2019re doing is going out into the redwoods or that\u2019s nearby campaign and testing out cool gear and writing blog post about it. What\u2019s your job really like? Is it as dreamy as folks imagine?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: No.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Not at all. It\u2019s one of those things where there are moments where I think to myself like wow, I can\u2019t believe this is my job. This is awesome. But for every one of those there is five of this massive headache or you\u2019re up all night, five nights in a row trying to figure out a problem. Running a business is definitely learning how to put out fires and whatever comes at you, you have to find a solution. So it\u2019s one of the things that you can\u2019t even imagine how many fires there are in the world so you can start running a business.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah. And the other thing is like we work really, really hard. I think that\u2019s probably something that maybe from the outside people don\u2019t appreciate as much, but everyone here works really, really hard I think. Part of that is we\u2019re bootstrapped and we make every penny count and I think there is a bit of self-selection in that. We\u2019re hard workers, so we bring in hard workers who have great attitude and sort of great fits with the Huckberry culture and kind of take our brand forward, but\u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: But that said we also make sure to play a times and like it\u2019s tough in a environment where you encourage to take a half day and drive, so you can get up, be in the traffic in the mountains and that sort of thing. So it\u2019s definitely a balance, but we work hard though, that\u2019s for sure.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah, because I think a lot of particularly young people, I mean they have this dream starting like a lifestyle business, right. Kind of like what you guys do. They imagine oh if I start this then I\u2019m my own boss and I will be a little \u2013 I just drop whatever whenever I\u2019m doing and it will be amazing, right. But they don\u2019t think about the logistics that you get into it \u2013 once you get bigger, problems get bigger and they grow exponentially. And just like \u2013 you don\u2019t think \u2013 I think a lot of people, they don\u2019t think about that part when they go into starting a business.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah, more money more problems.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: More money more problems, all right. So let\u2019s talk about Huckberry\u2019s future. So you\u2019ve mentioned a little bit about how you do these sort of meet ups or how you do the GORUCK War Stories and Beer, you did the Huckberry Holiday Home last year. So it seems like you guys are trying to actually get people physically together, it\u2019s not just online. Is that sort of like the future of Huckberry where you want to get people together in front of each other?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah. Again kind of circling the wagon back to the mission statement of inspiring miracle adventurous and stylish lives like right now we do that through commerce and we do that through content. But I think going forward we want to do that both in commerce and content better, but also we want to do it through in-person experiences and events. And I think the thing we\u2019re trying to do with Huckberry is really build a community of likeminded brands and people and blogs and create cool experiences that don\u2019t kind of currently exist in the world and put all those put together.<\/p>\n<p>So Brett I know we\u2019ve talked a lot about doing the Huckberry Holiday Home and doing Huckberry On The Road or in Art of Manliness an Huckberry event and just kind of putting our heads together and sort of creating a cool AOM and HB experience.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Yeah. I would \u2013 I think that will be awesome. We could do that. But right now you guys are doing that like Huckberry On The Road, right with the event?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: What\u2019s going on with that?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah. So we threw a party with Topo Designs in Denver this past Thursday, so just got from back that, awesome event. So the genesis of Huckberry On The Road is we have all these great relationships with brands all across the country, really cool factories behind these brands as a lot of these brands make their products in the U.S. And we sort of wanted a conduit to kind of tell their stories in-person either through video or through pictures or through local meet ups. And so our good friend John Gaffney who in the past has written for Valle and Gear Petrol and a few other publications pulled the sub-history to kind of quit his nine to five job and travel the world and sort of document or travel the U.S. I should say and document a lot of these guys and sort of dovetailed exactly with what we\u2019re trying to do.<\/p>\n<p>So we sponsored him to do it and sort of the official tagline is Exploring America and its Makers, Bakers, Movers and Shakers, sort of the fun tagline we came up with. And so threw our first event in Denver, had a great time, met a lot of AOM readers there which was just awesome, again kind of like what Richard was saying with the GORUCK event which was so fun and it\u2019s amazing to see the impact that you\u2019re having out there and it\u2019s just awesome when sort of two worlds collide. And so the punch line is Huckberry on the road is coming to many more cities. I think Portland is one of the next events we have coming up and hopefully maybe toss them in.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Got to be awesome.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Yeah. It\u2019s definitely about sort of encouraging sort of the experiential side of Huckberry, so lots of meet ups and happy hours and hikes and all those kind of things. So it\u2019s really about telling the story of our brand partners and what they\u2019re doing and then also meeting the Huckberrians out there and trying to do some cool stuff with them while we\u2019re on the road.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: Very cool. Well Andy and Rich, it\u2019s been a pleasure talking to you. Thanks so much for your time.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Richard Greiner<\/strong>: Thank you Brett, it\u2019s been a pleasure.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Andy Forch<\/strong>: Yeah, absolutely. Have a great long weekend.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Brett McKay<\/strong>: You too. Our guest today were Andy Forch and Richard Greiner. They are the Co-Founders of Huckberry and you can find out more about Huckberry by going to huckberry.com. And if you haven\u2019t signed up for the newsletter yet, if you use the URL aom.is\/huckberry, that\u2019s aom.is\/huckberry, you will get a $5 credit on your first purchase with Huckberry and yes, full transparency, that is an affiliate link. So I will make a small percentage of the sales on that which will help support the podcast and everything else that goes with the podcast, so I really appreciate that. And you get $5 credit which is great. So yeah, it\u2019s huckberry.com.<\/p>\n<p>That wraps up another edition of the Art of Manliness Podcast. For more manly tips and advice make sure to check out the Art of Manliness website at artofmanliness.com. And if you enjoy this podcast and you feel like you\u2019ve got something out of it, I would really appreciate it if you go to iTunes or Stitcher or whatever it is you use to listen to your podcast and give us a rating. That would help us out a lot. And until next time this is Brett McKay telling you to stay manly<\/p>\n<\/div>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>\ufeff Today I talk with Andy Forch and Richard Greiner, the co-founders of the men&#8217;s online store Huckberry. If you&#8217;re a business owner or have thought about starting your own business, this podcast is for you. 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